Vision Urbana After School Program

This week I started teaching a seven week personal finance course for middle school girls through the Vision Urbana After School Program. I’m serving as a volunteer with High Water Women (a non-profit organization for women in the hedge fund and financial services industry) and this is my second year teaching this course to middle school students. Earlier this week I met up with my co-teachers and fellow HWW members, Christine and Monica to discuss the curriculum and outline for our first class. After sharing ideas for ninety minutes, I left our meeting feeling prepared for our first class and confident that over the next seven weeks we were going to have a strong, positive impact on these kids.

As I approached the entrance on Thursday afternoon, a fight between a school boy and an older male was being broken up by school security outside the school gates…not the welcome I was expecting! Our class consists of about twelve middle school girls. They are a set of sassy, chatty ladies – but they are absolutely adorable. Walking into the room I felt like each of these ladies – going through puberty, endless peer pressure, non-stop homework and raging hormones - looked at us “grown-ups” thinking, “you have NO IDEA how stressful it is being me”!

Session 1: Decision Making, Opportunity Costs, Wants and Needs, Peer Pressure and Influence, Income and Jobs

I kicked things off with introductions, talked about High Water Women and asked them what they thought financial literacy was. Then we got them moving around with a human scavenger hunt icebreaker. Monica went through the decision making process, and how sometimes there are opportunity costs for our decisions. Next Christine had them share what they had bought in the last week – and separated them into wants vs. needs. My favorite was the young lady who argued that buying hair scrunchies was absolutely a need, “Imagine you wake up in the morning and your hair looks like a mess!” All her peers agreed that that scenario was completely unacceptable, and thus, scrunchies were indeed a necessity.

In the discussion about peer pressure, the ladies were able to define the term easily, but I was surprised that the group didn’t express that they felt like they made spending decisions based on pressure from their friends. After working with older teenagers in high school, it seems like that age group are more likely to buy certain brands or items out of peer pressure.

We divided them into teams of four and let them choose an advertisement out of a collection that we had found in magazines. We asked the students questions like: What is your initial impression of this advert? What product is being advertised? Why did the marketing team behind this ad choose this design? What type of audience are they trying to attract? Does it make you want to buy the product? Why/why not? If you were to design the next ad for this product would you stick with this theme or go for a new angle?

The three ads that the students picked to analyze: Ice breakers Sours with a girl with "weird eyebrows"; Covergirl Queen Collection with the astonishing tagline, "None of us are flawless" -Queen Latifah; and Edy's Ice Cream in Sr. and Jr. sizes

Monica led a discussion on jobs and income, and the ladies filled out some information about allowances and jobs that they could do today. She also had them discuss what it meant to “Invest in Yourself” and how level of education can affect your income potential. One of our ladies made the point, “it’s like, if you’re babysitting at 40 – you’ll be homeless basically” – we did clarify that being an au pair or nanny could actually be a lucrative career, but I think the girls had already convinced themselves otherwise.

Something I had wanted to do last year in our class was discuss a current affairs article with the students in each class. I found an article that I thought tied into our marketing discussion earlier. It was about how schools are considering selling advertising space to raise revenues. We asked them questions like why they thought schools were considering selling advertising space and if their school started doing this, would their spending decisions be influenced by the advertisements?

We finished up with a review of the class, and picked up the index cards we had left for them (to anonymously write any question that wanted to know about money). All in all it was a productive class and I can’t wait to go back now that I am familiar with the students. Unfortunately getting to stay engaged from 4pm-6pm on a Thursday evening for a topic as dry as personal finance will be tough, but with our passion, energy and fresh ideas, I can say with confidence that Christine, Monica and I are ready for the challenge.

Seminar at Operation HOPE

This past Saturday I led a money management and credit seminar for adults at Operation HOPE, Harlem. Even though I have taught the computer classes there for the last twelve months, I was a little nervous leading up to the class. My prior personal financial education teaching experiences have involved working with teenagers through High Water Women’s Financial Literacy program and the recent workshop with the READ Foundation. In those circumstances when discussing credit, the subject matter has been purely conceptual. Very few, if any at all, actually used credit cards so the workshops consisted of general advice for their future use. These adults had very real issues like high levels of credit card debt and low credit scores that were preventing a successful job search.

I did a lot of preparation for the class – and was sure to brush up on a range of topics that I was less well versed on (e.g. how declaring bankruptcy affects credit score, consumer’s rights with collection agencies and settling disputes on credit reports). I knew that most of the participants would be most interested in fixing their credit reports or improving their scores, but we began at the beginning – the psychology of spending. I felt that to understand how to improve a credit score we need to understand how credit works. To understand how credit works, we need to understand our income and expenses. To understand that, we had to begin by exploring our money values and habits. Over two and half hours we covered a lot of material!

The reason I was asked to lead this class was that the former credit and money management specialist retired and his replacement had only just been hired. The new credit and money management specialist happened to attend the class on Saturday and was so helpful for any questions that I wasn’t prepared for. For example, one question posed during the class was “Does using layaway affect your credit score”. My answer/guess was no (the item hasn’t left the store so there is no promise of repayment for a received good) and the new specialist was able to confirm that response for me. He also had some great perspective on how filing for bankruptcy can continue to haunt you even after the ten year period when it shows up on your credit report.

It was a fun class and I’m definitely looking forward to the next opportunity to lead a money management and credit class!

Personal Finance Workshop for Teens (part 5)

Here is the last part in our series of money questions posed by high school teens from the READ Foundation. Enjoy!

Part 5: Taxes*

1. How can I get fewer taxes deducted?

To understand this question, you need to consider the way the government collects taxes from your paycheck. Your employer will “withhold” a certain amount of each paycheck as a prepayment for your estimated overall tax bill for the year. Your overall tax bill is determined by your income and the tax brackets established by the government. If the amount withheld from your paycheck during the year is more than the amount you owe at the end of the year, you get a refund. If the amount withheld is less than the total owed, you will need to pay when you file your taxes to make up the difference.

The only way you can lower your overall taxes for the year is to save money in a tax-deductible account (such as a 401k, traditional IRA, Health Savings Account, etc.). This will decrease your taxes by decreasing the amount that you claim as income for the year. However, with your 401k and a Traditional IRA, you will need to pay taxes when you withdraw money from these accounts (in retirement) so this is really only a way of deferring your tax bill until later in life.

To have fewer taxes withheld from each individual paycheck, you can adjust your withholding on your W-4 form (one of the documents you complete when you start a new job). You can claim certain withholding allowances on your W-4 to lower the amount your employer withholds from each paycheck, but keep in mind that if you lower your withholding too much, you might end up needing to pay when you file your taxes.

2. How much money is taken out of a person’s pay check and why?

With regard to taxes (ignoring voluntary deductions such as 401k, medical insurance, etc) there are three main items taken out of every paycheck: Income taxes (federal and possibly state and/or local), Social Security and Medicare. Social Security and Medicare taxes are taken out at a flat rate of 6.2% for Social Security and 1.45% for Medicare. These deductions will sometimes show up with acronyms such as FICA-OASDI or FICA-HI, or another similar acronym. Income taxes are withheld from your paycheck using a more complicated system involving either Tables of Withholding or the Wage Bracket Method, but the general rule is that the higher your paycheck, the higher the percentage that will be withheld. This is due to the progressive tax system in the US, where tax rates increase as your income increases.

3. Why are there still taxes taken out of a young adult’s (18 years and younger) paycheck?

There is no lower age limit for paying taxes, however, there are income limits that allow low income earners to avoid federal (and possibly state) income taxes. Everyone, regardless of age, pays Social Security and Medicare taxes (mentioned in #45). Currently, if you make less than $9,350 (the combination of the Standard Deduction and Personal Exemption) you will owe no federal income taxes for the year and do not need to file a federal tax return. However, if you have had taxes withheld from your paycheck during the year, you may need to file in order to receive your refund. These rules get more complex if you are claimed as a dependent on your parents’ taxes.

4. Why are taxes still taken out after the W2 form was filled out when I said not to take out any taxes?

(Note, Form W-2 is a tax reporting form that is sent from your employer to you every year around January, saying how much you earned and how much was withheld in taxes during the past year. Form W-4 is the information form you fill out when applying for a new job.) Filling out your W-4 form allows you to claim certain withholding allowances (as mentioned in #44) which will increase or decrease the amount of taxes withheld from your paycheck, but will not fully eliminate your tax withholding. Also, regardless of the number of allowances you claim, everyone pays Social Security and Medicare tax (7.65% of income).

5. What taxes come out of a paycheck?

See #2

6. Why are different amounts of money taken out if it is a big check or a small one?

See #2

7. What taxes come out of a paycheck?

See #2

8. Do the taxes being taken out of our paychecks help the government? Where does it go?

All taxes taken out of your paycheck (less any amount refunded to you when you file your tax return) are collected by the government. The government uses this money to provide many programs and services, ranging from maintaining an active military, funding public education and building and repairing roads and bridges. The federal government is responsible for certain programs and services, which are different than the programs and services provided by states, cities and local governments. Also, keep in mind that the taxes taken out of your paycheck are not the only taxes used by the government to fund these programs. Property taxes on real estate, sales taxes and corporate taxes are also used to support government budgets.

9. Why does the city get to take out taxes?

See #8. The city will have certain programs and services it provides to citizens that are not covered by the federal budget. These programs are partially paid for using payroll taxes.

*Many thanks for Justin for answering the questions on taxes :)

Personal Finance Workshop for Teens (part 4)

Just as a reminder, I've been sharing the responses to a set of questions posed by high school teens in preparation for a workshop on personal finance. I gave them each a printed copy with all their questions answered. I included any duplicate questions, just so the students knew that none of their questions were silly, and to exhibit that many of their peers had asked similar questions too. Here is part four (the biggest) - money management. Enjoy!


Part 4: Money Management

1. How do I manage money?
A great technique is to create a budget or spending plan. You can do this by looking at the week or month ahead and trying to figure out how much income you will have (money coming in) and how much money you will spend. You can break it out into categories: Estimated Income, Fixed Expenses, Variable Expenses. Then follow through for that period and list every purchase you make and how much income you receive. At the end of the period take a look to see how far off you were to your estimation. What could you have cut back on? How can you save more next month?

2. How do I manage my money for school and still have money for myself?
See #1. You shouldn’t stop enjoying your life and doing things for yourself, but if you don’t have much money left for yourself, think about how to do the things you enjoy, for cheaper. An example is, instead of paying $13 for a movie ticket, go before noon on the weekends for half price! Budgeting isn’t always about abandoning the things you want to do, but sometimes finding the most cost effective way to accomplish them.

3. How do I save money when I am in college?
Again, work with a budget (see #1). Note your income and your expenses and what you need to do to meet your financial goals. Luckily, in college there tend to be lots of activities that are either free or very cheap. Check out the free movie nights, cheap bowling, and many other fun things to do on your campus.

4. How do you budget money when it is necessary to spend money?
See #1. Budgeting doesn’t mean “not spending”. It just means spending money smartly. Unfortunately, spending money is something everyone has to do, but we can look to improve our spending habits by being careful about how we spend and understanding the difference between our “needs” and our “wants”.

5. How do I balance between needs and wants and how do I budget each paycheck?
Differentiating needs and wants is essential as a consumer. Advertisements are created to lure us in and make us buy products, but before each purchase, stop and think “Do I REALLY need this?” “Is this the best deal I’m getting for this product?”. To budget your paychecks, think about your short and long term goals. Before your paycheck arrives, think about the period ahead before the next one and how you are going to use the money. Think about how much you want to save and what you need to spend money on. Track all your purchases and see at the end of the period if you are happy with how you have spent and saved your money.

6. How should I save money?
See #1.

7. How do I manage money right? See #1.

8. How do you save your money even though you are tempted to buy things?
See #1, #5 and #11.

9. How do I budget my paychecks?
See #5.

10. What does it mean to budget?
Budgeting means creating a plan for how income should be spent and saved.

11. How should you spend your money?
That is really a personal question that you have to figure out yourself. Begin by thinking about your “needs” versus your “wants”. Consider how much income you have coming in, and what your short term and long term goals are. You should also think about how much you hope to save in a given period. Give yourself a target saving amount and see if you can reach it! If you don’t make it, evaluate what you can do the next period to reach the target saving goal.

12. How do I manage money?
See #1.

13. What are the best techniques to manage money?
See #1.

14. How can my money grow?
There are many different ways for your money to grow. One of the safest and easiest ways for your money to collect some interest is to use a savings account. The interest your money gains is very small, maybe only 1%-2% a year, but it isn’t subject to market conditions (so you won’t lose your savings if the market crashes). If you want to invest, there are different options like mutual funds where you are exposed to the ups and downs of the market. You can also begin to put money into retirement accounts, where your money can grow over many years. By the time you are allowed to take money out, you could benefit from years of compounding interest. Note: Retirement accounts may be subject to market performance as well, depending on the investments you choose within these accounts.

15. How can I save my money?
See #1.

16. How do you save enough money and manage it in certain situations?
See #1.

17. How can I manage my money better?
See #1.

Personal Finance Workshop for Teens (part 3)

Part 3: Credit Cards/Debt

1. At what age should I get a credit card?
Using a credit card is a big responsibility. You should get one when you feel that fully understand exactly how the credit card works, how credit cards can help you, and how credit cards can hurt you. Most credit cards require users to be at least 18 years old, however there are some available if you sign up with an adult co-signer (make sure that it is in your name and that it will impact your credit score, not the adult co-signers credit score). The sooner you start using a credit card, the sooner your credit history begins. A portion of your credit score is determined by the length of your credit history. Having a good credit history for a long period of time will help you get lines of credit in the future, for example to buy a house or to take out a car loan.

2. Should I have a credit card when I am in college?
In my opinion, you should try to have a credit card once you turn 18, but ONLY if you feel mature enough to handle the responsibility. Bad credit card habits from your first card will stay with you and severely damage your chances for future credit.

3. Is it bad to keep borrowing from the bank when you have bad credit?
Getting out of debt is very difficult. If you have bad credit, it is likely because of poor money management skills at one time of your life. To fix your bad credit, you have to start getting smart about how you handle money. You have to prove that you can pay back your loans and that the bank can trust you. This takes months, sometimes years of paying bills on time, keeping your expenses under control and making smart money decisions. Until you can control your current debt to a manageable level, it’s generally a bad idea to keep borrowing money. If you have taken control of your debt, and you have a rational and reasonable plan for paying it all off, borrowing more for a worthy cause may not be a bad thing. But the key is to have a strong plan about how you will pay all your money back, keeping in mind that you can’t predict the future and you shouldn’t buy things that you can’t afford.

4. How much money is deducted per every minute that we’re late?
Late fees on a credit card payment vary by the terms set in your agreement. Typically, the fees are charged per day as opposed to per minute. Recent legislation to protect credit card users caps credit-card penalty fees at $25.

5. Is it necessary to have a credit card?
You can certainly live without one, but it will make it difficult to get credit in the future. Credit can include student loans, car loans, mortgages (home loans) etc. While it’s not really necessary to have a credit card as a high school student, you should consider opening one as a college student and starting to manage it wisely.

6. Does bad credit stay with you forever?
There are a few different types of bad credit – but to address the two big ones: Accurate negative information generally can be reported for seven years, but there are exceptions. Bankruptcy information can be reported for 10 years.

7. How can I get good credit?
Your lenders want to see that you are trustworthy. That you aren’t taking on too much debt, and that when you do take on debt, you have the ability to pay it off. Start exercising good credit habits! First: DON’T BUY WHAT YOU CAN’T AFFORD! When you get a credit card, staying below 50% of your credit limit is wise, below 30% is best. Pay your balance in full and on time. Don’t be late on your payments (set up a mobile alert or put it in your planner so you don’t forget!)

8. How do you keep your credit score good? What is a credit score?
See #7. A credit score is a number between 300-850 that shows your “creditworthiness”. It is a score calculated from items on your credit report that lets a lender know what your history is like (how many cards you’ve had, number of late payments, total debt you have, . A high score will help negotiate a lower interest fee on a future loan or more flexible terms. A low score will make it harder to secure a loan as a lender will be hesitant to give you a loan knowing that you’ve had trouble borrowing before. Scores generally fall between 650 an 700. A score above 700 is considered good credit management.

9. At what age should you get a credit card?
See #1.

10. How can I have multiple credit cards and maintain good credit?
If you have several credit cards, continue to be aware that you shouldn’t charge too much on any one of them. Try and spread out your purchases on all the cards so that no one card reaches over 30% of the credit limit. Some believe that the most important aspect of your credit score is the debt-to-limit ratio. This is a ratio indicating how much debt you have in relation to your credit limit. As a result, you will have a higher score if you have lots of available credit and pay your bills on time.

11. What happens when you are in debt?
First thing, is debt is EXPENSIVE!!! The longer you are in debt, the more you end up paying to the lender. For this reason alone, staying in debt for long periods of time is not good. Furthermore, if you have too much debt that is hard to control, a lender will be hesitant to lend you more money. If your car breaks and you have to get a new one, a lender who sees that you already have a lot of debt might deny you a loan or charge you a very high rate of interest. Over a few years, that $15,000 car, could end up costing you over $25,000! Not all debt is bad though. If you can manage your debt well, it will help build your credit and show that you are a responsible borrower. It’s borrowing too much and not paying it off quickly that will really hurt you in the long run. Remember, DON’T BUY WHAT YOU CAN’T AFFORD!

Personal Finance Workshop for Teens (part 2)

Here is part two of five sets of responses to the questions posed by a group of 40 high school students in preparation for a personal finance workshop I led last month. Comments and feedback are always appreciated!

Part 2: College

1. When should I start saving for college tuition?
If your parents want to start saving early, they can open a 529 plan for their child (regardless of the child’s age). If you want to know when you can start saving for your own college education, the sooner the better! Start putting aside small amounts of your paycheck for college and monitor how much you have saved over time. The bigger questions to try to answer are: where do you want to go to school and how much will it cost?

2. How should I save money for college?
There are lots of different ways to start saving for college. First of all you may want to find a part time job. Remember though, that you are a student first, and don’t overload your schedule so that it has a negative effect on your studies. Once you have a part time job, you can specifically aim to set aside a certain amount in savings every month. For example, set an amount that you will take out of your paycheck, like 10%, and take it out as soon as you receive it (and before you have the chance to spend it!).

3. What is the minimum amount of money given out on scholarships, grants, etc? How much can I plan to get for college?
There are no guarantees for any scholarship or financial aid. There are different criteria for each option to determine whether you are eligible or not. Some are “needs-based” and ask how much your parents make to determine if you experience financial hardship. For government aid you have to meet certain eligibility requirements (citizen or legal US resident, Social Security Number, high school diploma etc). Furthermore, your eligibility for aid depends on your Expected Family Contribution (EFC), your year in school, your enrollment status, and the cost of attendance at the school you will be attending. Your school’s financial aid office will tell you how much you can receive.
4. Would I have to pay the bank back for the whole four years if I get a specific loan or scholarship for college?
Whenever you borrow any money from the bank you have to pay them back for the amount you borrowed plus the interest you agreed to pay, regardless of other scholarships or loans you have taken on. If you have money available, it’s always a good idea to try and pay off your balance as quickly as possible. When you do this, try and pay off the loan with the highest interest rate first (that’s the one that will be the most expensive in the long run).

5. How do I afford college?
Begin to ask these questions: Why do you want to go to college? What type of career do you want after college? With your grades, test scores and career interest in mind, what are some of your options for college (include 4-year public, 4-year private, community colleges, vocational schools etc)? Are you eligible for federal aid? Will your family be contributing to your education? Will you be able to qualify for a private loan? Does the school have work-study programs available? Remember, there are LOTS of scholarships available too. There are scholarships for minorities, scholarships from religious organizations, scholarships for the career you want to persue, scholarships for the type of volunteer work you enjoy and also scholarships for first generation college students (if you are the first one in your family to go to college). The key is taking the time to research them and finding out what you might qualify for.

6. How can I save for college?
See #2.

7. How can I get a loan for school?
First, do a bit of research about what financial aid is available, and what you might be eligible for. There are federal loans, and private loans. You have to apply and show that you (or your parents) have a track record of trustworthiness. It’s very important to remember that a loan is NOT free money. The longer you take the pay it back, the more expensive it costs you. A $20,000 loan could end up costing as much as $40,000 if you wait 30 years to pay the entire balance off.

8. When getting our paychecks, how much money should we save for college?
It’s a personal decision, factoring in: how much you are currently making, how much college will cost, how long until you start college, whether you will be eligible for federal or private loans etc. See #2.

Personal Finance Workshop for Teens (part 1)

A few weeks ago I had the pleasure of teaching a two-hour personal finance workshop to forty high school students from the READ Foundation. This non-profit organization serves at risk kindergarten and first graders by recruiting and training teens to provide structured one-to-one tutoring in reading. The teen tutors participate in a program called “Build Your Future” which provide them with additional skills necessary for college and career success. For the first time, they decided to add a financial education component and I was honored to be asked to lead this initiative.

About two weeks before the workshop, I asked my contact at READ to have the teens write one question that they wanted to know about money. I was presented with 52 questions which I grouped into five categories: banking, college, credit cards, money management and taxes. I developed the two-hour workshop based on these five topics. With so much to cover in a short amount of time, I decided to answer every question and give it to the students as a supplement*. I wanted to share the responses in five installments and get feedback for any additional information that could have been included (or a correction if any information was incorrect!).

*Special thanks to Justin for responding to the tax questions.

Part 1: Banking

1. How much percent of your check should you put in the bank?
If possible, try and put your entire paycheck in your bank account. Having cash in your hands is not only a safety risk, but it’s a lot harder to stop yourself from spending when money isn’t as accessible. Typically you will receive a debit card that goes along with a checking account. With the debit card, you can always withdraw money from your account at an ATM.

2. How can I use a bank account to manage my money?
There are several ways. Firstly, many employers will offer you the option to use direct deposit when you get paid. This means that your paycheck will automatically be deposited into your checking account. It lessens the chance that you’ll forget to deposit a check, or the risk that you’ll spend the money if you have cash in your hands. Once you have money in the account, you may be able to use online banking to keep track of your money. You can log on anytime and see how much money is in the account, and if you make purchases on a linked debit card the expenses will automatically be shown. This can be important in verifying that you weren’t overcharged on an expense. With online banking you can also view images of old checks, transfer funds between accounts and pay bills. Lastly, banks usually offer financial planning tips and advice which will help learn how to manage your money.

3. Why is money destroyed after a certain amount of time?
The short answer… because like all things, money wears out and needs to be replaced occasionally. If you have a bill which is so badly worn out or damaged, you can take it to a bank and as long as at least half the bill is there, the bank will exchange it for a new one. If it is too badly damaged, you can try redeeming the bill by sending it to the Treasury Department who may be able to exchange it for you. The Federal Reserve banks pick up all the damaged bills around the country and shred them. A bag of the paper money shreds can be purchased if you visit one of the Federal Reserve Banks and take a tour of the facility. (Answer adapted from ehow.com ‘What Happens to Old Paper Money?’)

4. How much of your money should you put in the bank?
See #1.

5. What can I use a loan for?
You can use a loan for a variety of things. First of all there are two types of loans: secured and unsecured. Secured loans are backed by some sort of collateral, like a house. That means that in the event that you can’t pay the loan back, the bank has the right to take the asset for themselves. So if you take a loan for a home (mortgage) and can’t pay it back, the bank will take over the house and sell it to make up for the money you owe. Having this collateral makes the loan less risky for the bank, and they will therefore charge you a lower interest rate to borrow money that is secured. Types of secured loans include: car, boat, mortgages etc. An unsecured loan does not have any collateral behind it, so the interest rates are a lot higher (which means you’ll be paying a lot more to borrow the money). Types of unsecured loans include personal loans, credit cards and student loans. Remember, your ability to get a loan will depend on factors like credit history, employment status, income, assets, and debts at the time of application.

6. Can I trust a bank with my money?
Yes! In 1934, Congress established the Federal Deposit and Insurance Corporation (FDIC) to protect the money of depositors. Check that your bank is insured by the FDIC (most nationwide banks are insured, but always good to check!). The FDIC insures deposits up to $250,000 – so if you have for example, $1000 in your checking account and the bank fails, the FDIC will make sure that you don’t lose the $1000 because of the bank’s failure. Remember: FDIC covers only deposit accounts (like CDs, savings accounts and checking accounts) — not mutual funds and annuities.

7. How old do we have to be to get a bank account and have a credit card?
Usually the minimum age is 18 for a bank account and credit card. However that is not always the rule. There may be the chance to sign up for a joint account with an adult. If the big national banks say that you have to be 18, perhaps try a smaller community bank in the neighborhood. Ask them what the minimum age is to have a checking account (or credit card). Also ask them if there are any joint account opportunities, or if you can have an adult co-sign to open the account. Be sure to ask find out about all the fees associated with an account (monthly fee, annual fee, minimum amount in the account etc).

8. How could you manage a bank account?
See #1.

(Originally posted August 23, 2010)